Australian road toll heading the wrong way

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Thoglette
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Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Thoglette » Sun May 14, 2023 7:37 pm

Road toll rises in almost every state and territory, putting safety strategy 'badly off course' Jake Evans on a ABC

In the bleeding obvious category: more sprawl; inadequate public transport; more roads; more and more long haul freight on the roads; an increasingly dangerous vehicle fleet; reduced policing of basic road rules. What did we expect?
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warthog1
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby warthog1 » Sun May 14, 2023 8:40 pm

You left out increasing device distraction too.
That needs to be a licence suspension to underline the seriousness of it and reduce its' prevalence. It is rife.
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rkelsen
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby rkelsen » Sun May 14, 2023 10:37 pm

You forgot poor driver attitudes and quite apparently under-skilled drivers.

AdelaidePeter
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby AdelaidePeter » Mon May 15, 2023 10:46 am

Thoglette wrote:
Sun May 14, 2023 7:37 pm
Road toll rises in almost every state and territory, putting safety strategy 'badly off course' Jake Evans on a ABC

In the bleeding obvious category: more sprawl; inadequate public transport; more roads; more and more long haul freight on the roads; an increasingly dangerous vehicle fleet; reduced policing of basic road rules. What did we expect?
I think we need to ask why is it going up now? There have always been poor drivers, move away from public transport, lots of freight, etc. It was tracking down until (from memory) about 2012, then stabilised for a number of years.

I would like to see a proper analysis by a qualified statistician. A lot of the numbers could well be (very tragic) statistical anomalies. So e.g. Victoria, if the average is indeed 236 (12 months to 31 March 2022), then that would have a standard deviation of about 15, meaning a variation of +/- 30 would not be unusual. But you'd need to look at all data (all states, all years, injuries as well as deaths), which is why you'd need someone with more statistical qualifications (and more time on their hands) than me. I get very frustrated that they never even ask a mathematician or statistician for these news articles.

Mr Purple
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Mr Purple » Mon May 15, 2023 10:49 am

I would be wary of reading too much into these figures. The annual road toll has actually been remarkably stable for the past few years - and a third of what it was in the 70's, and even a half of what it was in the 90's. Considering the increasing traffic and population density that's actually pretty remarkable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_m ... ia_by_year

Though I do agree with driver attitudes and skill levels. This is reflected in the fact that the decreasing driver road toll (presumably largely due to car safety) is mirrored by a stable or increasing cyclist road toll.

https://s23705.pcdn.co/wp-content/uploa ... t_2020.pdf

My personal opinion is that there are a lot of drivers alive now that would have been dead if it weren't for side impact airbags and ABS brakes. The number of times I see drivers pull out from a side street onto a major road without even glancing slightly to their right is the biggest change I've noticed in the 25 years I've been driving.

We learned very early on not to do that. Because if you do that in a 1985 Corolla you die.

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baabaa
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby baabaa » Mon May 15, 2023 11:53 am

And a chance to do something simple and quick is is here

National Road Safety Week
I pledge to drive as if my loved ones are on the road ahead.
I will remove all distractions and never use my mobile phone while driving.
I will not put other people at risk by speeding, driving while tired or under the influence of alcohol/drugs.
I will protect all vulnerable road users, especially those whose job places them in harm’s way, by slowing down and giving them the space they need to be safe.

https://roadsafetyweek.com.au/

fat and old
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby fat and old » Mon May 15, 2023 12:24 pm

warthog1 wrote:
Sun May 14, 2023 8:40 pm
You left out increasing device distraction too.
That needs to be a licence suspension to underline the seriousness of it and reduce its' prevalence. It is rife.
I'm with you on this. It's no wonder the toll is going up, and the simplest answer is devices. And it won't stop while manufacturers continue to put cinema screens in their vehicles that will do 1001 different things on demand (including speedo! :shock: ). Who can resist that? I was shocked using a 2022 hilux last year. What is it like in a modern car????

And meanwhile, the pop up ads next to this are telling me to look at the latest G-String sets :shock: Predictive algorithm indeed! :lol:

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Thoglette
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Thoglette » Mon May 15, 2023 3:15 pm

AdelaidePeter wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 10:46 am
I think we need to ask why is it going up now? …. It was tracking down until (from memory) about 2012, then stabilised for a number of years.

I would like to see a proper analysis by a qualified statistician.
I’m with you on that. There’s probably funding in there for it too (I heard someone grizzling about the lack of national data)

I’d particularly like to see it analysed against hours driven, in the various ways this can be done.
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am50em
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby am50em » Mon May 15, 2023 4:00 pm

More breakdown and decadal trends available at https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/o ... _summaries

AdelaidePeter
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby AdelaidePeter » Mon May 15, 2023 4:41 pm

am50em wrote:
Mon May 15, 2023 4:00 pm
More breakdown and decadal trends available at https://www.bitre.gov.au/publications/o ... _summaries
Thanks for that. Here is part of the summary:
BITRE 2022 report wrote: In 2022, there were 1,194 road crash deaths. This is an increase of 5.8 per cent from 2021. Over the decade national fatalities have remained largely flat.

Fatality rates per population declined over the decade by a total of 10.4 per cent (from 5.1 to 4.6). The largest reductions in this rate were in New South Wales (down 20.1 per cent) and in South Australia (down 33.5 per cent).

Deaths of vulnerable road users (motorcyclist, pedestrian and pedal cyclist) were also largely flat over the decade. Within this group, motorcyclist deaths increased slightly and for pedestrians and pedal cyclists, the trends were both marginal reductions. Vehicle passenger deaths declined the most out of all road user groups (2.5 per cent per annum).
Far too sensible a summary to make it into the news, unfortunately.

One criticism I have of that report is that the hospitalisation numbers only go up to 2019. It's probably not the fault of the people writing the report, but why does it take 3+ years to get hospitalisation data into the database?

p.s. I'm not saying those numbers are acceptable; they are still horrific. I just don't think things are necessarily getting worse.

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Mububban
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Mububban » Fri May 19, 2023 2:12 pm

warthog1 wrote:
Sun May 14, 2023 8:40 pm
You left out increasing device distraction too.
That needs to be a licence suspension to underline the seriousness of it and reduce its' prevalence. It is rife.

Yes the number of people caught driving while distracted be devices by those new elevated cameras is truly shocking. It's the new drink driving, and just like drink driving attitudes used to be, everyone thinks "yeah but I'M a good safe driver, so even if I do it, I only do it when it's safe!" People love to fool themselves.
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Mr Purple
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Mr Purple » Fri May 19, 2023 4:07 pm

I saw my first mobile phone camera this week.

Image

Anyone distracted enough to miss something this obvious needs to be fined twice as much in my opinion.

It's telling they're catching so many people.

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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby fat and old » Sun May 21, 2023 7:18 am

Mr Purple wrote:
Fri May 19, 2023 4:07 pm
I saw my first mobile phone camera this week.

Image

Anyone distracted enough to miss something this obvious needs to be fined twice as much in my opinion.

It's telling they're catching so many people.
:lol: :lol: Caught by that? Dead set? lemme guess, Queensland? :lol:

Down here in Victoria they'll be camouflaged and unmarked. No effing about here!

fat and old
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby fat and old » Sun May 21, 2023 7:22 am

And another Guardian article on the road toll

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... es-at-risk

This one identified something I hadn't thought of as far as the reduction of deaths over time goes
"We’ve had this incredible reduction in road fatalities over 30 years,” Terrill said, mentioning seatbelts, speed and road-rule enforcement, improved vehicle safety technology, as well as better emergency services response times and the ability for people to call them quicker.

Very true. Props to Warty and his mates!

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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby warthog1 » Sun May 21, 2023 9:00 am

For us to be there quicker there needs to be a car available.
Old people using us as a taxi means there isn't.
There needs to be a financial penalty for calling an ambulance that makes it slightly more expensive than a taxi even for those with a pension or healthcare card.
Currently it is free and we are a free taxi service for a cohort of the population. Been that way for the 20+ years I've been in, just the cohort is getting bigger.
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Thoglette
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Thoglette » Sun May 21, 2023 4:20 pm

warthog1 wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 9:00 am
Currently it is free and we are a free taxi service for a cohort of the population. Been that way for the 20+ years I've been in, just the cohort is getting bigger.
The answer here is to make the taxi/uber free for that cohort, if going to a Hospital. Or GP. It's cheaper all around.
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby warthog1 » Sun May 21, 2023 5:56 pm

Thoglette wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 4:20 pm
warthog1 wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 9:00 am
Currently it is free and we are a free taxi service for a cohort of the population. Been that way for the 20+ years I've been in, just the cohort is getting bigger.
The answer here is to make the taxi/uber free for that cohort, if going to a Hospital. Or GP. It's cheaper all around.
Unconvinced that would work. We are very convenient, fast and free.
Pity that using a service designed to service emergencies, for routine nonsense, means those facing a life threatening condition may have a life changing/ending wait due to no resource being available. :x

It is a political no man's land to charge for ambulance so that may be the only option.
It would only work for a small portion however imo.
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Grog
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Grog » Sun May 21, 2023 7:22 pm

One of the biggest changes I’ve noticed last few years here in Tassie is the running of red lights just after the amber is much more prevalent.
Also seems to be more of a “meh” attitude to driving safely and to the conditions by a segment of the population.
Are people less risk aware? Or just don’t really care about anyone outside their cocoon?
I really don’t know.

fat and old
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby fat and old » Mon May 22, 2023 12:47 pm

Thoglette wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 4:20 pm
warthog1 wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 9:00 am
Currently it is free and we are a free taxi service for a cohort of the population. Been that way for the 20+ years I've been in, just the cohort is getting bigger.
The answer here is to make the taxi/uber free for that cohort, if going to a Hospital. Or GP. It's cheaper all around.
The answer exists (In Victoria anyway.) NPT.....patient transport. I used that for Mum's last radiation therapy block before she died. Worked pretty well, free to use also.

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Mububban
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby Mububban » Wed May 24, 2023 12:13 pm

Grog wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 7:22 pm
One of the biggest changes I’ve noticed last few years here in Tassie is the running of red lights just after the amber is much more prevalent.
Also seems to be more of a “meh” attitude to driving safely and to the conditions by a segment of the population.
Are people less risk aware? Or just don’t really care about anyone outside their cocoon?
I really don’t know.

Absolutely seeing more of this in Perth too. People know there's that second or two of lag time between one light turning red, and the other going green, and then another second or three before cars on the green actually start moving, so they floor it and run the amber/red knowing their risk of a crash is actually quite low.

Scumbags.
When you are driving your car, you are not stuck IN traffic - you ARE the traffic!!!

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cancan64
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby cancan64 » Wed May 24, 2023 12:59 pm

Its pretty bad in NZ, ytd (up to 24th may) is 116. comparing to the original link full Year to March was 374.
Red light running is bad, a few times had to hit the brakes on a green, tail gaiting is bad including heavy rain, foreign drivers on the wrong side of the road (happened in town last weekend).
Governments solution seems to be to lower the speed limit. Driving using a mobile phone has gone up to $150 fine but no cameras you need to be spotted. speeding fines are low as well and you dont lose demerit points if caught by a camera and they only have fixed cameras. Drink driving limit is 0.25 but that doesnt seem to stop many and again low fine until .05. All the big fines are for parking and using transit lane, but thats council
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g-boaf
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Re: Australian road toll heading the wrong way

Postby g-boaf » Sun May 28, 2023 6:33 pm

Grog wrote:
Sun May 21, 2023 7:22 pm
One of the biggest changes I’ve noticed last few years here in Tassie is the running of red lights just after the amber is much more prevalent.
Also seems to be more of a “meh” attitude to driving safely and to the conditions by a segment of the population.
Are people less risk aware? Or just don’t really care about anyone outside their cocoon?
I really don’t know.
This is common in Sydney too, everyone is so much in a hurry they just accelerate through at high speed.

I thought rego was supposed to stop this behaviour.

It’s to the point where at detain intersections you have to wait when the light goes green because of these selfish drivers. Also bad are the ones who queue through intersections and block everyone else.

Bring on silent automated electric cars.

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