Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
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Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:21 pm
My regular bike is an Oppy S1 steel frame, drop bar with disc brakes which is nice to ride but its on the heavy side and climbing hills kills me. I usually start the week off all excited about riding, but towards the tail end of the week I'm feeling wiped out and not so keen on getting on the bike.
I'm going to get a second bike so that I have a backup ride and have been looking into something that would make the climbs easier and be a bit more motivating to ride, either something a bit lighter and more agile like a flat bar roadie, or an e-bike.
The flat bars I've looked at are Cannondale Quick 1, Trek FX sport 4 and Giant Fastroad. So far I've only taken a Cannondale for a test ride, but it was at least 1 size too small and the carbon version, so maybe not a valid test... The bikes certainly feel substantially lighter to pick up compared to the current ride.
Some of the weight on the current ride comes from the panniers carrying clothes, bike lock, breakdown kit (tools and spares etc). The Oppy copes with the weight quite well but I'm worried that adding this weight to the back of a lighter bike with shorter chainstays may upset the handling.
Does anyone here have any experience with these types of bikes? Do they cope ok with a load? Will a few kgs less in bike weight make a noticable difference when it comes to climbing hills? I know that an e-bike will definitely cope with the load and the hills but I don't think the handling will be as involving as a lighter, more responsive bike. It's a bit like trying to choose between a sports car and an SUV - which compromise to make...?
Whichever way I go, racks, panniers and mudguards are mandatory as I will be riding in all conditions, but the flat bar is optional, I may also look at a gravel bike with drop bars, something more sport oriented rather than touring.
I plan on riding the current steelie for a few more weeks before making any decisions, to see if my climbing abilities improve noticably and make the decision a bit easier.
Any thoughts / experiences gratefully appreciated!
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby brumby33 » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:46 pm
At the same times you'll want something solid that'll take panniers day after day
You'll need guards to keep the splashing down to a minimum.
You'll need good lighting from a dyno set up that will also double as a mobile phone charging station.
Answer: Vivente World Randoneur
ok not light but they make the best commuter bikes...you shouldn't notice the weight with the low touring style gearing. Best value for an all equipped bike for under $2.8K
all you need is pannierrs...nothing else!!
https://viventebikes.com/recent-models
He has the recent models on another webpage than his current models which has been recently updated to include mostly Rollhoff hub models which are around $4800.....bit much for a commuter but you'll never break 'em ...they are a bike for life!!
VWR Patagonia 2017
2003 Diamondback Sorrento Sport MTB
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby Thoglette » Sat Jan 19, 2019 1:53 pm
You've already hit the nail on the head: you're going out way too hard on Monday (it's not a race) and you've got no hill fitness. Relax a bit and enjoy the ride. If you're running out of gears, fix that.
P.s e-bikes are many things but "agile" is not one of them.
"People are worthy of respect, ideas are not." Peter Ellerton, UQ
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby brumby33 » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:03 pm
And e-bikes are freaking heavy if you run out of battery power....Thoglette wrote:If you want to buy another bike, buy another bike. But don't blame the weight of the bike for your problems with hills. If you want to save some weight leave the lock at work.
You've already hit the nail on the head: you're going out way too hard on Monday (it's not a race) and you've got no hill fitness. Relax a bit and enjoy the ride. If you're running out of gears, fix that.
P.s e-bikes are many things but "agile" is not one of them.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:26 pm
Throw a compact crank on there, and maybe get the cassette up to 28t if it isn't already..add some stiff, light wheels and quick rolling rubber, job done.
I say this not knowing what's on your bike currently, although I note that the recent models were Claris 8sp with 50/34 cranks and an 11-32t cassette. The recent models also show 35mm rubber, and maybe a drop to 32 or even 28 would help the average speed without sacrificing too much comfort etc..
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:40 pm
I could go triple, but this would require an FD, shifter, granny ring and middle ring. I'll look into costs, the Claris is a decent groupset for the price.
As for the second bike, if I were to put it into car terms, I'd call the Oppy a family hatchback. I would also call the VWR a family hatchback, albeit a much better one. I don't think I want another hatchback, but I can't decide between sports car and SUV.
My concern with the sports car is that the reduced weight won't actually make all that much difference when it comes to climbing hills and that adding the required baggage on the rear will ruin the handling, which would defeat the purpose of the exercise. I just wanted to see if anyone here had experience with loaded-up flat bar.
I'm intrigued by the Orbea Gain, which is a lightweight ebike with a bit less assistance than regular ebikes, but with a weight under 14kg making it very similar to the Oppy. Finding one to test ride is a bit difficult though as it's a fairly new model..
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:50 pm
Pardon my silly question, but do you still have the no-name 35mm tyres on there? Dropping to something like a 32mm or even a 28mmMaxxis Re-fuse (or other road-oriented rubber) would probably make a noticeable difference.jools wrote:Modding the Oppy is not out of the question.....
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby RonK » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:58 pm
Such a bike will almost certainly come with higher gearing...jools wrote:My concern with the sports car is that the reduced weight won't actually make all that much difference when it comes to climbing hills...
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:29 pm
Sorry, forgot to mention, I'm running Schwalbe marathon plus in 32mm. Front wheel is standard, rear is the stock hub laced with better spokes to a Mavic A319 rim. I popped a bunch of spokes on the rear wheel within the first couple of days of owning it so I worked out a deal with the shop to have it rebuilt.10speedsemiracer wrote:Pardon my silly question, but do you still have the no-name 35mm tyres on there? Dropping to something like a 32mm or even a 28mmMaxxis Re-fuse (or other road-oriented rubber) would probably make a noticeable difference.jools wrote:Modding the Oppy is not out of the question.....
I started a thread about the Oppy when I was researching before purchase: viewtopic.php?f=81&t=88603&p=1331786#p1327507
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby RobertL » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:45 am
Your climbing abilities will improve over a few weeks, and you will wonder what all the fuss is about.jools wrote: I plan on riding the current steelie for a few more weeks before making any decisions, to see if my climbing abilities improve noticably and make the decision a bit easier.
Any thoughts / experiences gratefully appreciated!
Changing your bike to one of those that you have named will only save 3 or 4kg, which is about 3 or 4% of your all-up weight (making some assumptions, but close enough). That's a big difference if you are racing, but stuff-all for commuting. You already have a 34-32 lowest gear, which is pretty low.
I reckon just stick with it and you will naturally improve.
Of course, if you really want to buy another bike...
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby RonK » Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:46 pm
Marathon Plus a millstone around your neck when going up hills. Why would you bother?jools wrote:Sorry, forgot to mention, I'm running Schwalbe marathon plus in 32mm. Front wheel is standard, rear is the stock hub laced with better spokes to a Mavic A319 rim. I popped a bunch of spokes on the rear wheel within the first couple of days of owning it so I worked out a deal with the shop to have it rebuilt.10speedsemiracer wrote:Pardon my silly question, but do you still have the no-name 35mm tyres on there? Dropping to something like a 32mm or even a 28mmMaxxis Re-fuse (or other road-oriented rubber) would probably make a noticeable difference.jools wrote:Modding the Oppy is not out of the question.....
I started a thread about the Oppy when I was researching before purchase: viewtopic.php?f=81&t=88603&p=1331786#p1327507
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby Thoglette » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:00 pm
Just looked them up. 730 grams each. Same as a bidon full of water. The ubiquitous Conti gp4000 is half that weight. Then there's the light stuff.RonK wrote:Marathon Plus a millstone around your neck when going up hills. Why would you bother?
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:13 pm
More stupid questions (actually quite relevant..) but are you running the Schwalbes at low pressure or do you have them up around their max (which I think is 75psi). I find the Marathons are acceptable rollers when there's a bit of pressure in them.jools wrote:Sorry, forgot to mention, I'm running Schwalbe marathon plus in 32mm. Front wheel is standard, rear is the stock hub laced with better spokes to a Mavic A319 rim. I popped a bunch of spokes on the rear wheel within the first couple of days of owning it so I worked out a deal with the shop to have it rebuilt.10speedsemiracer wrote:Pardon my silly question, but do you still have the no-name 35mm tyres on there? Dropping to something like a 32mm or even a 28mmMaxxis Re-fuse (or other road-oriented rubber) would probably make a noticeable difference.jools wrote:Modding the Oppy is not out of the question.....
....
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:35 pm
It's probably also worth mentioning, I weigh around 120kg at the moment, plus another 10-15kg of bags, tools, clothes etc.. it's a bit of a load.. I'm trying to lose a lot of that excess weight, but it will take time.
The ride in was a bit easier today after a few days break and I think that another couple of weeks of consistent riding will make a big difference.
I do want to have a second bike set up for commuting so that I have a backup, but reading some of your very useful comments has me reconsidering my options. I'm thinking that maybe I need to look at a triple setup so I have a granny ring for the climbs and a big ring for the faster downhills. I'm also having second thoughts about the flat bar, maybe drop bars are more versatile.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby Calvin27 » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:46 pm
But the two factors are weight and fitness, they will both get better in time. Like cyclists say, it doesn't get easier, you just get faster.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:58 pm
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:24 pm
Honestly, I wouldn't move to the triple just yet, I feel a triple crank is a slightly drastic step. Is there any way you can shed some of the baggage, maybe leaving clothes/shoes at work etc? The only other thing I would recommend is ensuring the bike is in the best condition it can be in. Free-rolling hubs, smooth BB, brakes that don't drag and a nice fresh chain/cogs are all part of making sure the bike is working with you, not against you.jools wrote:I usually run 80-90psi, the tyres read 95psi max. 80 is a little more comfortable but 90 rolls better. I realise the SMPs are heavy, but I've never had a flat, they last for ages and can handle the different conditions I ride through.
It's probably also worth mentioning, I weigh around 120kg at the moment, plus another 10-15kg of bags, tools, clothes etc.. it's a bit of a load.. I'm trying to lose a lot of that excess weight, but it will take time.
The ride in was a bit easier today after a few days break and I think that another couple of weeks of consistent riding will make a big difference.
I do want to have a second bike set up for commuting so that I have a backup, but reading some of your very useful comments has me reconsidering my options. I'm thinking that maybe I need to look at a triple setup so I have a granny ring for the climbs and a big ring for the faster downhills. I'm also having second thoughts about the flat bar, maybe drop bars are more versatile.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:37 pm
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:15 pm
I do a few of these (neo-resto/restomod, whatever) and they end up being very nice to ride, but I'm a little bit of a retro-grouch (I like steelies)
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby 10speedsemiracer » Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:26 pm
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby Thoglette » Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:05 pm
Ok, well that justifies the tyre and pressure choice. Light weight tyres aren't going to last long with that set up.jools wrote:It's probably also worth mentioning, I weigh around 120kg at the moment, plus another 10-15kg of bags, tools, clothes etc.. it's a bit of a load..
If you're going to bike number 2, see if you can get some bigger tyres under it. I'm commuting with around 60% of your total load and consider 32mm the minimum for commuting. That'd be about 45mm for you.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Sun May 12, 2019 6:57 pm
Brothers from another mother:
Actually it was more a case of circumstances rather than decisions... a friend of mine has an e-bike business and was selling his demo bike to upgrade to a new model, so in late January I picked up his 2017 Riese & Muller Charger with upgraded lights, brakes and computer for a big discount. It was a good decision as I've been riding it daily and only used public transport twice since getting it.
With the ebike I'm not concerned at all about hills whereas previously I would go out of my way to avoid them. I've also reduced the assistance level to 50% to get more of a workout while riding, so as a consequence my hill climbing ability has actually improved much more than expected.
Over the easter break I was browsing gumtree and ended buying 3 more bikes - 2 are projects and the third is a 2014 specialized sirrus comp, with 105 gears and hydro disc brakes which was going for a good price. It's needed some work and I have just finished it off and looking forward to riding it to work one day this week.
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby opik_bidin » Mon May 20, 2019 2:22 pm
Asking for A bike advicejools wrote:I couldn't decide and ended up getting both
Brothers from another mother:
Actually it was more a case of circumstances rather than decisions... a friend of mine has an e-bike business and was selling his demo bike to upgrade to a new model, so in late January I picked up his 2017 Riese & Muller Charger with upgraded lights, brakes and computer for a big discount. It was a good decision as I've been riding it daily and only used public transport twice since getting it.
With the ebike I'm not concerned at all about hills whereas previously I would go out of my way to avoid them. I've also reduced the assistance level to 50% to get more of a workout while riding, so as a consequence my hill climbing ability has actually improved much more than expected.
Over the easter break I was browsing gumtree and ended buying 3 more bikes - 2 are projects and the third is a 2014 specialized sirrus comp, with 105 gears and hydro disc brakes which was going for a good price. It's needed some work and I have just finished it off and looking forward to riding it to work one day this week.
Thought about modding
Ended up doing n+++
Typical
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Re: Commuter bike advice - coping with hills
Postby jools » Mon May 20, 2019 8:26 pm
opik_bidin wrote:
Asking for A bike advice
Thought about modding
Ended up doing n+++
Typical
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